Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group

[Clint]

[Jeff Carlsen]

I don't believe that the rapid attack rules are particularly confusing in and of themselves, but they expect that you know something about firearms. In case that is the problem, here is the rundown using real-world terms:

Single-Shot: Only holds one round. Can fire once, then has to be reloaded.

Most medieval ranged weapons are single shot, as are most old black powder weapons.

Single-shot weapons are denoted in the chart by the number of rounds they require to reload. A single-shot weapon cannot use Rapid Attack, Double Tap, or anything else that requires more than one shot.

Single Action: Can hold more than one round, but the user has to manually work an action between shots.

Revolvers used to be built this way. You had to cock the hammer with your thumb between every shot. This would rotate the cylinder, bringing the round in line with the firing pin, as well as ready the hammer for the next shot. As far as I can tell, there are no single action revolvers listed in SWD.

Pump action shotguns and many rifles are also single-action weapons.

All firearms are Single Action unless stated otherwise (such as Semi-Auto, Auto, or Revolver) Single Action weapons cannot use Rapid Attack, Double Tap, or any other action that requires multiple shots, with one exception. You can fan the hammer of a single action revolver by using Rapid Attack. This involves holding down the trigger and rapidly pulling back the hammer and letting it go, usually with the palm of your hand.

Double Action: A revolver that mechanically rotates the cylinder and cocks the hammer whenever the trigger is pulled.

Double Action revolvers are denoted as Revolver, but are also Semi-Automatic, and follow the same rules.

Semi-Automatic: Fires one round every time the trigger is pulled.

Most semi-automatic weapons use the force of the discharged round and a slide mechanism to automatically reload themselves and cock the hammer. While double action revolvers are technically semi-automatic, the term is usually used to refer to magazine fed, slide based weapons.

Semi-Automatic Weapons are denoted as Semi-Auto. They can be used with Rapid Attack and Double Tap.

Fully Automatic: Continues to fire for as long as the trigger is held down.

Fully automatic rifles are the mainstay of the modern military. They fire hundreds of rounds of ammunition per minute, or they would, if they didn't overheat or run out of ammo. This is useful for suppressive fire, or for making the untrained more effective, but the amount of ammunition wasted is expensive.

Most fully automatic rifles have multiple firing modes, allowing them to function as semi-automatic, and some can even fire three round bursts.

Machine guns are larger fully automatic weapons designed for a larger scale of destruction. Smaller machine guns are free-standing or mounted on trucks, and are meant for area control. Larger ones are attached to large vehicles and aircraft, and are generally intended for use against vehicles and buildings.

Fully automatic weapons are denoted as having a Rate of Fire of 2 or greater. Those that can also fire in semi-automatic mode are designated Auto. When in full auto mode, they use the Automatic rules and may not use Rapid Attack. Switching firing modes is a free action.

Three Round Burst: Fires three rounds every time the trigger is pulled.

Some Automatic Weapons come with a three round bust function. It is a separate firing mode that limits the number of rounds fired to three.

This function is denoted by 3RB. It cannot be combined with Rapid Attack, double tap, or any other rules that allow multiple attacks.


So, Rapid Attack can only be used with melee weapons, semi-automatic firearms and single action revolvers. It cannot be combined with any other actions that permit multiple attacks, but it may be combined with wild attack and called shots.

Did I make any mistakes or miss something? If so, I'll fix it.
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[ValhallaGH]

[ValhallaGH]

[Clint]

[ogbendog]

although, oddly, on page 70 it says,

[Clint]

[Jeff Carlsen]

Fixed. Thank you.

Though I'll admit, using Auto do designate that a RoF 3 weapon can fire in semi-automatic mode is awkward. I probably would have gone the Shadowrun method, and just had a column for available firing modes. *shrug*
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[ValhallaGH]

[Harlan]

[Bernd]

[77IM]

When I make weapons for my home campaigns (I haven't done this in some time) I make RoF a range of numbers and list the special option right with it. Something like:

M16: RoF 1-3, 3RB
Uzi: RoF 1-3
M60: RoF 3

.44 Magnum: RoF 1
Beretta: RoF 1, DT
Double-Barreled Shotgun: RoF 1-2 (each uses only 1 ammo)


I just drop the Auto and Semi-Auto designation because it doesn't make any sense to me and isn't needed to understand the game mechanics. Instead of "Auto," if the RoF is 1-3 then you can fire 1, 2, or 3 shots, but if it's only RoF 3 then you can't fire 1 or 2 shots (no Auto). Instead of "Semi-Auto," just list Double Tap as an option (DT). Double-barreled shotgun now uses the normal rules for RoF but presumably each shot only uses one shell so it just gets a special note.

-- 77IM
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Stuff I made: Arcane Abilities · Talent Edge · Savage Fading Suns · Savage Wuxia!

[ValhallaGH]

[Timon]

I never imagined that my innocent query would generate such discussion. I hope that some clarity has also emerged.
This being the first RPG I have played that has guns (not counting Paranoia, no really not) actually I find that I now do need to know more about firearms.
I learnt quite a bit about medieval weaponry back when I started playing D&D, I can tell a Claymore from a Partisan, so it makes sense to pick up this bit of background too.

Guns are pretty rare in Britain and the Netherlands: I have never actually seen a real gun up close or held one, let alone fired one. That is probably true for most Europeans, so I found Jeff's guns 101 very helpful <tip of the hat>.
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Biting! It's like kissing but there's a winner!
The Doctor's Wife

[jpk]

I just moved to a fairly rural area. In addition to having a dinner guest arrive by tractor, I was offered the loan of at least three shotguns until I could get one of my own.

It can be a different place here in the States...

[operations]

When I moved to central Michigan, people kept offering me shotguns on the cheap cause I didn't have one yet. I finally took someone up on an offer for a 2-gauge break action single barrel for $25.

Simple, easy to clean, and fun to shoot skeet with.
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~~KT~~

[Jeff Carlsen]

Yeah. The idea that someone from Europe has never even seen a gun up close is a little strange for me, who lives in the USA. It's a little like saying, "I've never seen a sewing machine." Sure, not everyone has one, and most of them are stored away somewhere, but they're around.

That said, it's true that many people are not familiar with them, especially in Europe, and have no way to be so without active research. Perhaps our game rules need give these descriptions.

Not wanting to know how they work is fine, so long as you don't intend firearms to have an important roll in a game. If the only guns characters in your game carry are pistols and hunting rifles, you can just assume they can each only attack once per round, and don't worry about anything else.

But, if you want to use rules for the wide variety of guns, you need to understand how guns work. It's no different than having to know the difference between a bow and a crossbow, or a sword and a mace. Without that knowledge, you'd never understand why you don't stab someone with a mace, or why it takes a round to reload a crossbow.

Anyway, at one point I started a writeup about firearms and their differences, but never finished it. I'm thinking that I should do so. A roleplayer's guide to firearms.
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[J Gregory]

[DustDevil]

[Lord Lance]