Username:    Password:      Remember me       
Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group
Discussion Forum for PEG/GWG
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

grapple with a called shot to the arm

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index -> SW General Chat & Game Stories
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
longarms
Seasoned


Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 150

PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 12:43 am    Post subject: grapple with a called shot to the arm Reply with quote

There is an entangle edge in the Pirates setting (and probably in some other settings as well). It calls for a "disarm attack". If successful, the target counts as an unarmed defender. The defender requires a "break grapple" to escape.

I had a hard time memorizing the specific rules, until just the other day when I realized that the "disarm attack" was really just a grapple with a called shot to the right arm! And the benefit of a successful grapple to the right arm really just a grapple, but the attacker gets the added benefit of not being counted as an unarmed defender as per a normal grapple. Make so much more sense this way Laughing

The only question I have now is why does it require an edge! I've seen people here discussing "called shots" to initiate a grapple (such as a called shot to the head to get +4 damage on subsequent grapple checks). In these discussions, the extra benefit for the called shot did not require an edge to receive (you just got it for taking the penalty to hit on the original grapple). Anyone see any problem with using these rules anytime a PC makes a called shot to the right arm for a grapple? (got to give them some benefit that makes sense).


PS - I have been reading a book on martial arts in Medieval Europe. It contrasts between the clench (a standing grapple) and an "all in" grapple (a grapple on the ground). It mentioned that standing grapples were allowed the attacker to still defend himself against third parties, whereas obviously in an all-in grapple the attacker is obviously very vulnerable to attacks by third parties. Made me think of the "entangle" grapple vs. normal grapple in savage worlds...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rachan
Seasoned


Joined: 03 Nov 2010
Posts: 284
Location: Alberta, Canada

PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:36 am    Post subject: Re: grapple with a called shot to the arm Reply with quote

longarms wrote:
I've seen people here discussing "called shots" to initiate a grapple (such as a called shot to the head to get +4 damage on subsequent grapple checks).


Entangle edge aside, I don't think you CAN call a shot on a grapple. You might flavor it up by saying "headlock" or "arm bar," but I don't think you get the attack penalties or damage bonuses.

And a +4 damage on subsequent grapples just sounds like milking the system. It's broken.
_________________
[quote="77IM"] it's not specifically allowed by the rules, but the GM is specifically allowed to allow it. Wink[/quote]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Granthar
Seasoned


Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 3:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my experience called shots only give you the extra damage because your objective is to cause direct damage. A grapple however is just imobilisation so I'm pretty sure my GM would allow the use of a called shot. Not sure if it would be better to try a wild attack to the arm to disarm instead?
_________________

Check out my latest Rippers adventure at http://rippertales.wikia.com/wiki/Tom_%22Rig%22_Jenson
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
islan
Heroic


Joined: 17 Dec 2008
Posts: 1140

PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A Called Shot is something you can do with any attack roll, and so it works with Grappling as well. However, you would not (necessarily) get +4 damage from putting someone in a headlock, as the damage caused by a Grapple is not directly tied to the Grapple roll as Grappling is a "non-damaging attack". The damage from Grappling is tied to a separate opposed Strength/Agility roll. I could be wrong on this, however, so please feel free to correct me.

I'm not sure on this one part, but can anyone point out to me where it says that characters engaged in a grapple are considered Unarmed Defenders?

Unless there is something more to this Edge that is not mentioned here, this sounds like a very poorly designed Edge, and a good example of what I talked about in this thread: http://www.peginc.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29584
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Raskolnik
Novice


Joined: 12 Nov 2010
Posts: 84
Location: Berlin, Germany

PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a comment of Clint about that:

Question: So, if I make my called shot [to the head] on round 1, I can continue getting +4 damage every round, automatically, until my opponent beats my grapple to get away?


Answer: I'd say so. The GM could continue to apply the -4 penalty to hold onto the target as well. The penalty continues, so the bonus would as well.
_________________
Savaged Fallout homebrew
Low Life and other stuff
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lord Lance
Heroic


Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 1416
Location: Vicenza, Italy

PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 7:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

About that edge, I have no rules under my nose, but I can imagine it give the ability to make a sort of grapple just with 1 arm/weapon, while standard grapple use all your "body", so you have to do that full unarmed and keeping yourself quite "busy".
_________________
"Balance is the key, Trapping is the word." - - Lord Lance

Proud creator of the SAVAGE FREE BESTIARY
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Clint
Site Admin


Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 17339

PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Lance wrote:
About that edge, I have no rules under my nose, but I can imagine it give the ability to make a sort of grapple just with 1 arm/weapon, while standard grapple use all your "body", so you have to do that full unarmed and keeping yourself quite "busy".


Exactly. That Edge specifies that the character can entangle the opponent with one arm and still attack him with the other. Regular grapples use both hands by default.
_________________
Clint Black
Savage Worlds Core Rules Brand Manager

www.peginc.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
islan
Heroic


Joined: 17 Dec 2008
Posts: 1140

PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clint wrote:


Exactly. That Edge specifies that the character can entangle the opponent with one arm and still attack him with the other. Regular grapples use both hands by default.


Ah, then that makes it a much more useful Edge.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
77IM
Heroic


Joined: 23 Jun 2009
Posts: 1591
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2010 10:36 am    Post subject: Re: grapple with a called shot to the arm Reply with quote

longarms wrote:
I've seen people here discussing "called shots" to initiate a grapple (such as a called shot to the head to get +4 damage on subsequent grapple checks).


I like this rule, because it gives a lot more variety to grappling for very little effort. I have one guy in my group who does a lot of martial arts and is always wanting to do crazy grapples so it helps to just say "called shot" and be done with it.

-- 77IM
_________________
Stuff I made: Arcane Abilities Talent Edge Savage Fading Suns Savage Wuxia!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index -> SW General Chat & Game Stories All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum