Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group

[Grom]

Hey, guys.

This is my first post on these forums, though I've been lurking for a little while. I'm fairly new to Deadlands: Reloaded as a game system; I've been running an online game for a few months now, but that's not really that long in the scheme of things.

Recently, one of my characters found himself Harrowed. The decision to bring him back made sense - I could definitely see his character, a Danny Trejo playalike based on the character Machete but transplaneted into the West, coming back from beyond the grave to wreak a bit more mayhem before someone puts him down for good. The player can definitely handle the responsibility and was definitely excited about the new opportunities for his character. But there's a hitch.

My biggest problem is going to be keeping him in check. His character isn't exactly the heroic type; he robs, lies and kills in equal measure, mostly because he feels like it. This naturally means any 'heroic' plots, like saving the world, are a bit hard to involve him - he's really not that interested in being a 'good guy.'

That's one problem. The other is balancing his powers. One of the first Edges he took was Ghost, which as I'm sure you all know allows him to turn 'incorporeal'. The player got thinking and put it to me that, in theory, he'd be able to 'ghost' through a wall - say, into a bank vault - and grab the gold, then 'ghost' his way back out. Another one of his plots involves tracking down and killing a judge, which he's decided will be child's play if he walks up to him, uses his claws to slash the man's throat out, and then ghosts through the floor.

It's definitely creative application of the rules, but I'm not sure how his powers will affect the game. Being able to pull off flawless bank heists and kill targets with ease in non-combat situations could definitely affect the game's balance, but I don't really want to just outright block him or make things unfair. My only real ideas now are to involve the Agency or the Rangers, but so far the group's been bouncing through the Disputed Territories...

So that's what I need help with: how can I involve a semi-psychotic, 'evil' character in plots focussed on doing good and battling the Reckoners, and how can I deal with his newfound powers in a fair way? Any ideas or tips you guys can provide would be much appreciated!

[Sadric]

You wrote your player could handle the responsibility. Does he know that he has a evil little demon in his head? Dominion rolls? Tell him every time he does something "bad" he need to make a Dominion roll. Dont take controll of his character if he fails. The Manitou simply take pleasure by the carnage the character does. Maybe give the manitou even a bonus because the character shows his black soul. The dominion score should go down fairly fast.
And then you could show the player the really bad things a manitou could do. Get to your senses bloodcaked a few miles from the last city and doesnt knowing what you had done is pretty unsettling.
Especially if the money from his last bankrobbery is still in the city (where he is probably searched for because of his unknwon cruel deeds)

BTW it doesnt sound like battling the Reckoner is high on the priority list of your player.
Do you have other players or is it a one on one game? How deal the other player with this unheroic player?

[lifthraser]

I dont like evil characters in Deadlands, i dont even like neutral characters, i like my players to be heroes. There is so much evil in this world, adding more seems like overkill.

I never had a player harrowed in my games, even if i kill a lot of player no one ever drew a joker, or made so much sense as an harrowed to convince me to cheat the pull.

The ghost power seems really powerful... even dangerous to the scenarios lol.

If anyone has advice how to handle such a power i'm listening.

[Cutter XXIII]

[geijhan]

How do your other players feel about the evil cowpoke in their midst?

Honestly, if it was me and we were running around trying to save the world, I wouldn't really like it if the town where we just removed a threat went up in Fear level because the townfolk started to see ghosts walking through the walls, murdering lawmen etc., just because somebody wanted to get their Evil on.

Have an honest talk with the player. If he still wants to go through with this angle, explain that his dominion rolls WILL start going south (no dice fudging or GM fiat needed) and that he'll end up in NPC territory shortly.

[Grom]

Wow, thanks for the prompt replies, guys! I was out and just got home, and typing on an iPod is a rather painful experience, so bear with me.
 
Now, let's see here...

[Sitting Duck]

[Marshal G]

Hi Grom, welcome!

Three small comments from me -

1) Your harrowed wouldn't mind much if a whole town was massacred, it would just piss him off that he doesn't remember having done it? Sounds like the wrong attitude for a character. Not all have to be heroes, sure, but that's outright psycho mentality (sorry if I turned around a few words and didn't cite the exact phrasing). Very tough to involve him in any campaign, if you ask me, and if you allow it, I'd build on the other players to control him or outright start to oppose him...

2) The idea of turning the dead body in again and again made me laugh, but you could actually use that to your advantage. Why not have a junior Texas Ranger NPC hear from the outlaw's bounty being collected but then the body disappeared? Makes him curious and he's on a mission, and - you have an ever potent (or ever quiet, if it currently doesn't suit the campaign situation for the Ranger to occur) enemy who might directly or indirectly take control of the critter-in-the-posse for you...

3) Knowledge of the metaplot... I always used what was in the adventures, so after much stuff earlier, Jackie Wells in the Heart of Darkness trilogy was their revelation. But I can picture a more subtle approach, too. Know the series Fringe? After introducing the "weirdness of the week" for a while, all started to focus on the metaplot and it was cornered around a weird book which revealed a strange theory.
How about letting them find it and from time to time revealing a little more, as the character who has it in his gear has read (or understood) a little more?
The good thing is, the book can contain red herings or wrong interpretations in some areas and be 100% correct in others. Plus, as described, you can use it continously, just as the Ranger Bible doesn't make its owner a 120% expert of anything, or like Hoyle's book sounds like a game theory for most, it might be difficult to catch the real meaning of sth in that book on first glance...

Keep us posted on your critter
_________________
nothing's forgotten, nothing's ever forgotten...

[Fists-of-Dorn]

Miscreants can be difficult to handle as player characters, but remember that anyone can be interested in performing a task; how a person is received for performing the task is up to the individuals who hear about it. You seem to know what the character wants, so working that in should not be too difficult. From simple mercenary terms of "I pay you 'X' to kill 'Y' marauding injuns", to more subtle means of working in a big rich target for him to lock on to which happens to be right in the middle of the metaplot.
A person doesn't necessarily need to like someone in order to save them from being murdered, he just needs to hate the murderer more. Perhaps you can work up a plot where the character gets to try and frame the judge that sentenced him. The idea of getting to attend the smug judge's own hanging might settle the character down enough to collect his thoughts and do it right.
For the rest of the characters involved, perhaps the judge is actually involved in something sinister. Perhaps not the guy running the show, but somehow involved nonetheless. If so then everyone is happily pursuing the same goal of stopping whatever horror is going on, but each for his own reasons and using his own methods.


As for turning in the same bounty over and over, that would be some tedious work. I doubt the character would want to dig himself out of the grave every time, and if not then the other characters would have to do it. Most of the ones described seem like they would end up squabbling over who earned what share of the money because of this.
This isn't mentioning that after a few successes, word will have traveled far enough that the bounty would get rescinded. However going in with the notion that it would only work for a few towns, it could be worthwhile for them, though it could eventually come back to bite them all in the butt.

I do like the idea of a young Ranger/ Agent getting on the trail of the Ghostly Bank Bandit though. That seems like it would certainly provide some lasting entertainment as he crops up from session to session, getting closer to the truth of not only the harrowed criminal, but his cohorts as well.


I would say that as long as you work to give the characters motivation to act, you can expect a good end result. Be careful about feeling like you are railroading anyone into something even if you felt it was in their character's interest to do it. Humans are not always rational, so don't expect characters in rpgs to be either As long as the characters have an in-character reason to pursue a goal, it'll probably get done later if not sooner.


Good luck with your game.


-Fists.

[catalac]

hmm i know you have probably already found your answer to the roleplaying issues. but for some other things like stopping assassinations
two things i don't believe the rule book said anything about the ghost being invisible. i just thought that he looked real but people couldn't touch him like demons in the hollows series. also if not that (which was just my weird concept) how about this plenty of myths make it so two incorporeal beings can fight each other. i think this likely because if it wasn't possible people with the ghost ability could survive stone and as hoe assumes no hero, not a single one survives to try to stop the fall into chaos. there has to be a way for stone to kill incorporeals because stone can kill anybody.

[cloudshaper2k]

One more twist, I'd suggest. Since the Ghost power says a successful magical attack turns him coporeal again, I'd lay a trap or two for him if he starts doing what he's thinking of. A Voodooist bounty hunter and his pals might take to dogging his trail.

And never forget that nothing occurs in a vacuum. For everyone he guns down in cold blood, there's a host of family members, grieving lovers, and enraged friends who'll come gunning for the Harrowed and anyone who rides the trail with him. Some of those are going to have powers of their own - perhaps similar ones that could be turned against the posse. (Players will come up with ways to defeat their own tricks when you turn them around and use them on the party.)

[ValhallaGH]

Mmm. Shambling zombie threads. So very tasty.


Seriously guys, stop resurrecting every thread that's been over for 2+ months. By this point the problem's been resolved, and it's not like anyone (successfully) searches the archives when they are seeking answers for a similar problem.
So, you'll get to post your insights in the new threads, where people will actually use them.
_________________
"Got a problem? I've got the solution: Rocket Launcher."
"Not against a Servitor."
"... We're all gonna die."

[Jonah Hex]

[catalac]

lol. well if valhallagh posted on it when i did it the first time i wonder what will happen this time
the point is eventually it would be a danger to his life. if it becomes to overt... well people fear the unknown and they kill it when that unknown becomes real. the whole story of the reckoning is about how evil was defeated because humans fought back, this time their not going to be so direct. the demon will step in to stop him from ruining the reckonings plans even if its because he helped them toooo much.

[Big Bad Jack]

My old game had a similar Harrowed, though more petty, tricky, and greedy than out and out murderous.

The control rod?

"SCREW YOU, YOU AIN'T GETTING MY SOUL!" -- to save his own self, he decided to fight the Reckoners.

Usually in a vicious way, but still...