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robert4818
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 Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:57 pm Post subject: How would you do a Vorpal Sword. |
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I'm using the "DnD" definition of Vorpal Swords. I.E. Swords that have a tendency to cut off people's heads.
In DnD they did this on a natural roll of a 20.
How would you handle it in Savage Worlds?
I have two philosophies with this idea, one much weaker than the other.
The first is that if a player rolls 2 raises on the attack roll, the weapon decapitates the target.
The second is that the sword automatically makes called shots to the head without a penalty. (Obviously if something has no head, this has no effect).
Just wonder what you guys think?
How would you handle a "Vorpal" weapon.
OOPS: Noticed I put this in the wrong forum.
Last edited by robert4818 on Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:53 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Averjoe
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| Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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I would go middle ground of the two. If the attacker gets two raises on the attack roll, then the attack is treated as a called shot to the head. Not an automatic kill, but pretty good chance.
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farik
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| Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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5d4 damage. Those damage dice will be exploding all the time.  |
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Vinzent
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:34 am Post subject: |
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I wouldn't. For one the Vorpal blade is from the Jabberwocky poem in Alice in Wonderland. Second it is the sword of "ultimate smiting" which in my mind would only make the game boring.
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ValhallaGH
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 2:07 am Post subject: |
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A vorpal-like weapons?
| me wrote: | | Vorpal: Unique to slashing weapons, vorpal is one of the most fearsome and powerful weapon enchantments. With a raise on the attack, the weapon automatically targets the neck (a vital area for most beings) in addition to the normal effects of a raise. If the target would be Incapacitated by this attack then they are decapitated. Creatures that need their heads find this extremely problematic. |
A raise automatically goes for the neck, and Incapacitated targets automatically lose their head - bypassing Harder to Kill. Sort of a "if this drops you then you're dead."
Vorpal is an obscenely powerful ability. I feel that I've done it justice.
For giggles:
| Quote: | | Sharp: Only found on bladed weapons, a sharp weapon seeks holes in the target’s armor. With a raise on the attack, it automatically targets the least armored limb (in addition to the normal benefits of a raise on the attack). |
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kaltorak
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 2:44 am Post subject: |
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| I'll leave the sword stats as they are, but I'll say that the damage dices burst on n-1 and n, results. For example a vorpal long sword (used by a Str d8 character) causes d8+d8 damages. The dice damages aces on 7,8. |
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robert4818
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 3:15 am Post subject: |
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| Vinzent wrote: | | I wouldn't. For one the Vorpal blade is from the Jabberwocky poem in Alice in Wonderland. Second it is the sword of "ultimate smiting" which in my mind would only make the game boring. |
I know the origin of Vorpal, which is why I said I was using the DnD version.
As for not using it, its just a thought on the how to do something like that. |
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VonDan
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 3:39 am Post subject: |
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Jabberwocky By Lewis Carrol
From the Book
Through the Looking-Glass, and What Alice Found There,
'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe;
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.
"Beware the Jabberwock, my son
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
He took his vorpal sword in hand;
Long time the manxome foe he sought –
So rested he by the Tumtum tree,
And stood awhile in thought.
And, as in uffish thought he stood,
The Jabberwock, with eyes of flame,
Came whiffling through the tulgey wood,
And burbled as it came!
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back.
"And hast thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!"
He chortled in his joy.
'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe;
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jabberwocky
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Dire Weasel
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 4:18 am Post subject: |
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| 50F contains such a weapon. Check the plot point "Debauchery". |
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Timon
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 6:25 am Post subject: |
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I think that anyone using a Vorpal Sword has to be prepared to say "snicker-snack" every time it cuts off a head. That was probably the very first instance of product placement of course.
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Vorpal
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Timon wrote: | | I think that anyone using a Vorpal Sword has to be prepared to say "snicker-snack" every time it cuts off a head. That was probably the very first instance of product placement of course. |
"Oh behave. Snicker-Snack, baby!"
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Merlin_Sylver
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Vinzent wrote: | | I wouldn't. For one the Vorpal blade is from the Jabberwocky poem in Alice in Wonderland. Second it is the sword of "ultimate smiting" which in my mind would only make the game boring. |
Oh, I don't think I'd call it a sword of ultimate smiting... by D&D standards, the Vorpal sword only went off 5% of the time, the other 95% of the time, it's only a +1 blade.
With that in mind, I think I'd set it up that if you hit with a raise on BOTH dice (main skill and wild), then the attack automatically targets the neck. This does mean that no extra could use the Vorpal ability...
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newForumNewName
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Merlin_Sylver wrote: | Oh, I don't think I'd call it a sword of ultimate smiting... by D&D standards, the Vorpal sword only went off 5% of the time, the other 95% of the time, it's only a +1 blade.
With that in mind, I think I'd set it up that if you hit with a raise on BOTH dice (main skill and wild), then the attack automatically targets the neck. This does mean that no extra could use the Vorpal ability... |
What about getting a raise when targeting Vitals (-4)? That means that the dice have to roll 8 higher than the target's Parry to get the Vorpol to trigger AND that the attacker has to specify that they are trying it.
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decalod85
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Merlin_Sylver wrote: |
Oh, I don't think I'd call it a sword of ultimate smiting... by D&D standards, the Vorpal sword only went off 5% of the time, the other 95% of the time, it's only a +1 blade. |
Correct. It never went off fighting mooks, but only in the first round while facing the BBEG that the DM spent hours working on. |
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The Dread Polack
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:52 am Post subject: |
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Well, if you just want it to work like Vorpal Sword- roll a D20 along with your fighting die. If you roll a 20, you cut off your enemies head 
If you want it to be more SW, then I think you need to ask yourself how powerful you want it to be. You can always make it powerful. The seperate, but equally important question is whether you think it's too powerful for your group.
I like ValhallaGH's solution. I just don't think I'd want my players to have one. |
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SavageGamerGirl
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:15 am Post subject: |
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I think a vorpal sword is an artifact in Wonderland No More. If you want I could look it up and tell you how it works in that setting.
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Merlin_Sylver
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:16 am Post subject: |
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| newForumNewName wrote: | | Merlin_Sylver wrote: | Oh, I don't think I'd call it a sword of ultimate smiting... by D&D standards, the Vorpal sword only went off 5% of the time, the other 95% of the time, it's only a +1 blade.
With that in mind, I think I'd set it up that if you hit with a raise on BOTH dice (main skill and wild), then the attack automatically targets the neck. This does mean that no extra could use the Vorpal ability... |
What about getting a raise when targeting Vitals (-4)? That means that the dice have to roll 8 higher than the target's Parry to get the Vorpol to trigger AND that the attacker has to specify that they are trying it. |
I think part of the charm of the Vorpal blade was that you didn't have to be trying... the blade just sort of sought out the decapitation shot every now and then.
Of course, that brings us to a fundamental difference of rule sets that makes converting the Vorpal sword a bit difficult, and that is that D&D has never had called shot rules that were worth using. The only rules I ever read regarding called shots was in the Monster Manual's description of the Hydra. The Vorpal could kill a monster in the first round of combat regardless of it's hit points... and in Savage Worlds it's completely possible to kill a monster in the first round of combat with your bare fists, even one with an obscene toughness. In all honesty, the Vorpal sword of D&D was powerful because it ignored hit points and DR, since Savage Worlds has neither of those things, converting will be odd.
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canology
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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You could set a high but not impossible number, like 20, and if the wielder's attack roll is at least a 20, then the target is decapitated.
The only problem with that idea is that it ties the head-lopping to the user's skill, which isn't the case with the D&D item. |
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Jordan Peacock
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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| SavageGamerGirl wrote: | | I think a vorpal sword is an artifact in Wonderland No More. If you want I could look it up and tell you how it works in that setting. |
Yes, the Vorpal Blade is mentioned in Wonderland No More, but there's no special concern about decapitation with it. As Merlin_Sylver noted, Savage Worlds isn't hit-point-based, so there's little special value in just bypassing the HP whittle effect and going straight for decapitation as there was in D&D. Instead, the WNM version focuses on "can cut through anything" in terms of being a Heavy Weapon with armor-piercing. If you happen to deal enough damage to one-shot-kill an Extra ... well! The GM can declare the poor guy decapitated as part of the window-dressing, I suppose.
I guess if you want a sword that randomly seeks out the head, you could declare a random chance that the sword automatically makes a head shot (with the accompanying bonus to damage upon a hit, but without the penalty to hit for the called shot). It might be fun to make it 1 in 1d20 if only because some guy finally gets to use his d20 in Savage Worlds. Huzzah!
And then, if he manages to deal enough damage to one-shot-kill his enemy, the GM declares it a decapitation; no Aftermath Vigor rolls to see if he survives. It's a bit messier if a Wild Card is involved; maybe it's for Extras only (or for "not-important-to-the-plot" Wild Cards).
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Last edited by Jordan Peacock on Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:41 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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robert4818
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| Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Merlin_Sylver wrote: | | newForumNewName wrote: | | Merlin_Sylver wrote: | Oh, I don't think I'd call it a sword of ultimate smiting... by D&D standards, the Vorpal sword only went off 5% of the time, the other 95% of the time, it's only a +1 blade.
With that in mind, I think I'd set it up that if you hit with a raise on BOTH dice (main skill and wild), then the attack automatically targets the neck. This does mean that no extra could use the Vorpal ability... |
What about getting a raise when targeting Vitals (-4)? That means that the dice have to roll 8 higher than the target's Parry to get the Vorpol to trigger AND that the attacker has to specify that they are trying it. |
I think part of the charm of the Vorpal blade was that you didn't have to be trying... the blade just sort of sought out the decapitation shot every now and then.
Of course, that brings us to a fundamental difference of rule sets that makes converting the Vorpal sword a bit difficult, and that is that D&D has never had called shot rules that were worth using. The only rules I ever read regarding called shots was in the Monster Manual's description of the Hydra. The Vorpal could kill a monster in the first round of combat regardless of it's hit points... and in Savage Worlds it's completely possible to kill a monster in the first round of combat with your bare fists, even one with an obscene toughness. In all honesty, the Vorpal sword of D&D was powerful because it ignored hit points and DR, since Savage Worlds has neither of those things, converting will be odd. |
While Vorpal in DnD Ignored HP, I think the SW equivalent would be a sword that ignores toughness and wounds. That being said, I don't really think vorpal is as bad in SW as some people think it is.
What does vorpal do? It merely kills something in a single hit. A not to uncommon thing in SW anyways. Extras are kinda designed to do this, and its not rare for it to happen to big bads. All vorpal does is change the critera from being insanely high damage to one of fairly high roll.
In the end though, I don't see it as game breaking, espeically in SW compared to DnD
| canology wrote: | You could set a high but not impossible number, like 20, and if the wielder's attack roll is at least a 20, then the target is decapitated.
The only problem with that idea is that it ties the head-lopping to the user's skill, which isn't the case with the D&D item. |
Setting an arbitrarily high number (like natural roll of 20) in SW doesn't work well. This is because in D20 this arbitrarily high number came with a set 5% chance of occuring. In SW, given the number of dice that just doesn't make sense. That 5% thresh hold is met at different levels depending on the die used. (For example, a 5% roll on a SW d4 is around 13 and is 18 on a d12) |
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