Username:    Password:      Remember me       
Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group
Discussion Forum for PEG/GWG
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Big Bad Mage
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index -> SW General Chat & Game Stories
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Vinzent
Veteran


Joined: 13 Mar 2009
Posts: 759
Location: Seattle WA

PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 3:46 am    Post subject: Big Bad Mage Reply with quote

I'm running the conclusion to one of my games soon and the heroes will be up against a big bad mage. I don't want him going down like a punk since he is supposed to be thousands of years old.

I though of giving him the ability to cast two spells per round. Is there a set of edges that would allow his, should I just fudge it, or is this going way too powerful?

Advice?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
dentris
Seasoned


Joined: 02 Jul 2007
Posts: 372

PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, if you use the Arcane Background (Super Powers), you can use two different powers in the same round because they are different skills.

On the other hand, if you want a true "magical" foe, maybe create a unique edge similar to Improved Frenzy, but for powers instead of attacks. I don't think it's overpowered for a villain, but it all depends on your group mentality. Does your mages will insist on the fact that if a villain has access to this edge, they should too? In that case, it could be overpowered in the hands of a PC.
_________________
But the Voice consoles me and it says: "Keep your dreams;
Wise men do not have such beautiful ones as fools!"
--Baudelaire, Les Fleurs du Mal, 1857, Translated by William Aggeler, 1954
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SeeleyOne
Seasoned


Joined: 29 Sep 2010
Posts: 229

PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just make one of the requirements be "must be thousands of years old" Razz
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Shadowdragon
Seasoned


Joined: 12 Dec 2004
Posts: 390
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The great thing about SW is that villains and monsters don't have to follow the same creation rules as PCs. If you want your villain to be able to do something make it a special ability. For a thousands of years old mage you could give him something like Spell Merging (may cast two spells as a single Action). He could also have things like Hardy, maybe some (super)natural armour, etc. For a really tough boss you could even make a special ability that makes it so the mage wont take more than 1 wound from any given attack no matter how much damage is actually done.
_________________
http://tristansnexus.wordpress.com/ - A gallery of some of the minis I've painted over the years
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
robert4818
Heroic


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Posts: 1045

PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depending on where the fight will be:

Give him true regeneration.

In his tower/lab/HQ
Don't tell the players that he was wounded, simply describe them a description of the wounds closing. Have them make a notice (-4 to -6) check. If they succede, tell them they notice some large clear vat in the corner bubble up (like a water cooler that's just had a glass filled from it) when he took the wound. As long as the vat is intact, he has the equivalent of ~100 wounds. Once the vat is destroyed, he has 3.

Given the difficulty of the notice check, (they are after all concentrating on the Big Bad, not on noticing that a test-tube bubbled) the battle should last quite a few rounds. Once they do notice and take out the test-tube, who cares if he goes down like a chump.


Last edited by robert4818 on Sat Apr 02, 2011 2:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JackMann
Veteran


Joined: 29 Dec 2010
Posts: 694
Location: Tucson, AZ

PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Echoing what SD said. You've got a much bigger toychest as GM than your players do. Don't feel afraid to use it. So long as the Big Bad is beatable, go ahead. If the players complain about him doing things they can't, explain it from an in-game perspective (he's thousands of years old and has had time to learn things they haven't) and from an out-of-game perspective (he has to stand up to the entire team of PCs and make a challenging, end-of-game fight).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lord Lance
Heroic


Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 1406
Location: Vicenza, Italy

PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

... and / or start the battle with the mage already 'powered on'. So he has deflection and armor active. Don't let a thief character takes the mage with Drop, or the fun will be over before it starts! You can have the big mage warned by a sort of magical alarm.
_________________
"Balance is the key, Trapping is the word." - - Lord Lance

Proud creator of the SAVAGE FREE BESTIARY
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
marshal kt
Legendary


Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 2396
Location: west palm beach, fl

PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the great thing about being 'thousands of years old' is has has great toys.
He should have rings, bracers and amulets with spells stored in them.
His jewelry would could have the barrier/amror/deflection spell cast on it.
His rings could have offensive and defensive spells on them.

Spells that increase his stats, giving him quickness or improved level-headed.

Look over using devices in NE. My super sorceror for NE has all of his powers in jewelry he was wearing.
_________________
"I'm Hotep"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Merlin_Sylver
Veteran


Joined: 02 Oct 2009
Posts: 869
Location: I wish I knew...

PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I pretty much agree with most of what's been posted here... though I would say that, if your players come up with an ingenous plan or get some really awesome rolls, don't take away their incredible victory just to make the fight last longer. A good way to make your players feel great about what seemed to be an easy victory is to explain just how nasty this guy really was, after the fact. Show them what his defenses were, and tell them what spells he was going to cast... in the end, they'll be thrilled that they took the guy down quickly.
_________________
Yes! I have captured your cat and placed him in this box where he will either flourish or perish as chance dictates!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
skylion
Veteran


Joined: 21 Aug 2003
Posts: 753
Location: Covington, Ky

PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If one makes it to "thousand of years old" status, he probably didn't get there by accident. While it is true the Mage has taken extreme risks; be them very calculated, he knows 'when to hold 'em and when to fold 'em'.

Perhaps his longevity is a curse; that would make his age more due to the curse than any planning on his part, at least at first. He lives, he dies, he comes back, cranky, sore and looking for behinds to kick because he is just so darn cranky. And he's gotten good at doing it.

He values the placement of his fighting ground. Just look at the film 300. This Mage is skilled at picking his own "hot gates'. So skilled he could be in a class by himself.

He values not fighting. If it is a choice between risking life and limb and not, well a long long long life could suggest not fighting unless is was necessary.

Maybe, he just doesn't want to die, he has an obsession with not dying. Is the afterlife for him going to be something he wants to avoid and nearly all costs? Maybe he has learned some heavenly/infernal tricks to keep himself going that the players can't/won't undertand. This could be any of the supernatural powers suggested above.

And then there are the heroes. They are the heroes after all, and it should be them that takes this guy out. Their game after all.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
robert4818
Heroic


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Posts: 1045

PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess one last general note.

Remember that this isn't DnD. So you don't necessarily need the group on one big bad fight.

He might also be surrounded by his fanatically loyal guards, in a room full of traps, etc. etc. etc.

If you, in the end, have one WC bad guy, vs the party and there's nothing special about the circumstances/battlefield/guy then you are doing something wrong and the guy will fall like a chump.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ian
Seasoned


Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 420
Location: in a Glasgow(Scotland) library

PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you want him to cast two spells, give the bad guy a demon familiar which can cast a spell for him on his action card. Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ogbendog
Heroic


Joined: 29 Jul 2004
Posts: 1913

PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

golems. familiars. enslaved demons. etc.

spare bodies. kill one, he possesses another.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Vinzent
Veteran


Joined: 13 Mar 2009
Posts: 759
Location: Seattle WA

PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ogbendog wrote:
golems. familiars. enslaved demons. etc.

spare bodies. kill one, he possesses another.


Cool idea. I will use it in the future.

The game played out very well. Although the Big Bad didn't get to do much, the heroes were freaked out enough to keep the pressure on him. He managed to get two Blasts off at one of the heroes who spent all of his bennies for soak. Then they kept him shaken with blows until the sharpshooter could take him down.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
marshal kt
Legendary


Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 2396
Location: west palm beach, fl

PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the mage could also enter an item he's wearing, sort of like an old soul gem from back in AD&D or even the gems the eldar in 40k wear.

the item would radiate strong magic, the mage's, and the player who gets it would end up having to fight for possession with the mage. After a long term. You could even have it like a harrowed vs it's manitou like in DL.
The mage PC would want the item since it's strong magic, but he doesn't know what it really is. You could say he could learn that it's the mage's power, and has to figure out how to use/gain it. [that wouldn't be a lie, since a mage's power is himself.]

It alone could be the basis or even tie-ins to quests and adventures. Finding someone to figure out what the magic is. Then how to unlock it.

A key or clue could be something like, you have to completely open yourself to the power. [allow possesion]. the player wouldn't know it, but...

The player, would also want to get back all of the npc mage's stuff, if he doesn't still have it. It could/would be clues to releasing the power. [actually the npc giving him unconscious suggestions on how to use the power. when in reality, it's his way of gaining control and domination over the body.]
_________________
"I'm Hotep"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
VonDan
Legendary


Joined: 08 Jul 2008
Posts: 3250

PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lyrics contest for Big Bad Mage

http://www.lyrics007.com/Johnny%20Cash%20Lyrics/Big%20Bad%20John%20Lyrics.html
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
ValhallaGH
Legendary


Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 4475

PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vinzent wrote:
Then they kept him shaken with blows until the sharpshooter could take him down.


Undead / Construct with Combat Reflexes fixes this problem in a hurry. Immune to called shots, and gets an amazing +4 to recover from Shaken (guaranteeing success, and making a Raise likely).

Throw on Quickness (Headband of Alacrity), Bracers of Armor (a classic), a Ring of Protection (permanent deflection, probably with a raise), and maybe a cloak of Flight, and you've got a danged scary evil wizard. Even if you don't give him Hardy (my favorite monstrous ability), he'll still be a nightmare, excluding that one awesome shot (usually one of the ones from the first round).
Soak that, though, and he'll hang around for ages. Good fun.
_________________
"Got a problem? I've got the solution: Rocket Launcher."
"Not against a Servitor."
"... We're all gonna die."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HawaiianBrian
Veteran


Joined: 14 May 2007
Posts: 583
Location: Portland, Oregon

PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dentris wrote:
Does your mages will insist on the fact that if a villain has access to this edge, they should too? In that case, it could be overpowered in the hands of a PC.


That mentality is one of the most annoying developments in RPGs in the last decade. I never had to contend with it through the 80s and 90s, then all of a sudden I couldn't do anything outside the "box" anymore without players whining and crying "unfair." I see my main work as a GM nowadays as trying to deprogram that idea wherever I find it, one gaming group at a time.

As to the original poster's point, yes, just make it happen. You don't need an Edge, just do it. If you spellcasters demand equal access, tell them just like in real life there are things you have never encountered and don't have access to. End of story.
_________________
***** HawaiianBrian / getsavaged.blogspot.com *****
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
HawaiianBrian
Veteran


Joined: 14 May 2007
Posts: 583
Location: Portland, Oregon

PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadowdragon wrote:
The great thing about SW is that villains and monsters don't have to follow the same creation rules as PCs. If you want your villain to be able to do something make it a special ability. For a thousands of years old mage you could give him something like Spell Merging (may cast two spells as a single Action). He could also have things like Hardy, maybe some (super)natural armour, etc. For a really tough boss you could even make a special ability that makes it so the mage wont take more than 1 wound from any given attack no matter how much damage is actually done.


There was a really cool device from D&D's Book of Vile Darkness, a collar that connected the wearer to up to four helpless slaves. Every time one took damage, the damage was divided among the four slaves. Good characters had a moral crisis: keep attacking and kill the helpless slaves, or let the bad guy go? You could do something similar in SW with wound-sharing.
_________________
***** HawaiianBrian / getsavaged.blogspot.com *****
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
TheLoremaster
Heroic


Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 1916
Location: Buffalo, NY

PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HawaiianBrian wrote:
That mentality is one of the most annoying developments in RPGs in the last decade. I never had to contend with it through the 80s and 90s, then all of a sudden I couldn't do anything outside the "box" anymore without players whining and crying "unfair." I see my main work as a GM nowadays as trying to deprogram that idea wherever I find it, one gaming group at a time.

To interject: I've used the "goose and gander" rule since the 90's, when I learned it from a different GM. "If it's good for the goose, it's good for the gander" means that it isn't fair to give the NPCs an ability or item that the PCs can't have. It may not be available until after the NPC uses it, but once he does, it's open for everyone. You are also free to set the requirements as high as needed, but it should still be available.

Works both ways: if the PCs have guns, the bad guys will too. If the PC figured out a way to carry a portable nuclear accelerator, well, ... Twisted Evil

So I know for a fact it's not a new development, but an important part of game balance.
_________________
"Your GM is metagaming ... and wrong!"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index -> SW General Chat & Game Stories All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
Page 1 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum