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newForumNewName
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 3:19 pm    Post subject: Character concept... Reply with quote

Is Doctor Manhattan possible to create in Necessary Evil or SPC? If so, how?
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Max Schreck
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Were I to run a Watchmen campaign, I would not find it necessary to create Dr. Manhattan with a full character write-up, any more than I would stat up the White Jade Emperor in a wuxia fantasy campaign, or indeed other cosmic entities in other campaigns.

Dr. Manhattan has reality distorting powers, almost total matter control on a sub-atomic level, is everywhere in the time-space continuum at once and is invulnerable even to complete atomic annihilation. So it could actually be argued that Dr. Manhattan is even more transcendent than a standard deity

Why would one even want to create such an entity as an NPC? The GM has but to wave his hand and intone: "Dr. Manhattan moves the universe slightly to the left."

So, in short, could one build Dr. Manhattan with SW rules?
I doubt it very much. Maybe one could, but then the question is rather: should one bother?

The answer to that is a resounding no for my part. Why bother statting up a nigh-omnipotent entity?

Cheers,

Max
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jpk
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd suggest that he couldn't adequately be statted up in pretty much any system. He just can.
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newForumNewName
Heroic


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, there goes my first choice for character concept in Necessary Evil...
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jpk
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now, if you want to stat out a "beginning Dr. Manhattan" that hasn't yet fully realized how god-like he is, that'd be easy. Pick a few of his demonstrated powers and run with 'em. Maybe Growth, Super Strength, Ranged Attack, and some Deflection.

But, really, guys like Dr. Manhattan, the Beyonder, Galactus, Mephisto, Darkseid, et al, don't tend to be usable as balanced PCs in most supers games.
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newForumNewName
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The same could be said for Green Lantern, Superman, Martian Manhunter, Dream of the Endless (any of the seven personifications, really), The Phoenix, Jenny Sparks (and Jenny Quantum, for that matter), Apollo (from The Authority), or even just Thor. That was just me illustrating how big of a comic book nerd I am, more than anything. Nerd powers... GO!

I think that I'll do as you suggest though and go with a pre-full-potential Dr. Manhattan.
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Clint
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First thing to note at that power level would be the use of the Cosmic Environmental Rules from the SPC, and most likely Power Points in the Major League range.
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ValhallaGH
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Max Schreck wrote:
Dr. Manhattan has reality distorting powers, almost total matter control on a sub-atomic level, is everywhere in the time-space continuum at once and is invulnerable even to complete atomic annihilation. So it could actually be argued that Dr. Manhattan is even more transcendent than a standard deity

Ditto.

Dr. Manhattan fulfills the search criteria for a deity better than most deities do. He is, quite completely, a plot device. The entire plot changes because he exists, and occasionally chooses to do something.
Giving him rules is like saying gods are limited to powers that mimic D&D spells; a game mechanic that completely disposes of the character concept.


As for what to play in NE, remember that you're a villain that hasn't taken over the world yet. Playing something easily confused with God doesn't really fit that conceit.
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Snate56
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you just want to play a naked blue guy, then go for it...



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JmOz01
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jpk wrote:
I'd suggest that he couldn't adequately be statted up in pretty much any system. He just can.


I have to disagree with this, I do feel he can be fairly well represented in a couple systems fairly well. DC Heroes RPG 2nd or 3rd edition from Mayfair, or Champions 4th-6th edition from Hero could both do it. But as a disclaimor both are point buy systems, and the GM would have to approve a very large point total for the game.
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kreider204
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Dr. M also could be stated up in the original Marvel FASERIP system pretty easily - just give him lots of Class 1000 abilities. Even better, the first edition of the game allowed for a character creation that wasn't random or point-based: you just describe the character you want, and if your GM approves, you work together to stat him.
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JmOz01
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree on the FASERIP version, if oyu are willing to rework the magic system to include a cosmic power system. The hardest part IMO is the can do anything, the two I mentioned have that in "Omni-Power" and VPP, FASERIP has it in the magic system IIRC
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kreider204
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya, the original Marvel magic system was pretty much "Do anything you can think of, with an effect limited by your Psyche rank."
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newForumNewName
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 1:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ValhallaGH wrote:
As for what to play in NE, remember that you're a villain that hasn't taken over the world yet. Playing something easily confused with God doesn't really fit that conceit.

I was thinking of a newly minted Dr Manhattan. Perhaps a scientist that was among the heroes when they were destroyed (thus accounting for the disintegration). One that has not yet discovered the extent to which he has changed by recreating himself from nothing. But enough of the comments here have convinced me that playing a character in that vein wouldn't be as fun as I originally thought. I kind of thought that having him constantly asking "why should I care?" or having a female "villain" seduce and convince him to act (sort of like Sally Jupiter does to Dr Manhattan on Mars in Watchmen), but on a longer timeline and when Dr Manhattan doesn't have the level of understanding about what he can do.

I'm pretty convinced that the idea is a non-starter anyway unless I want to GM the game (which I don't).
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Clint
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

newForumNewName wrote:
I was thinking of a newly minted Dr Manhattan. Perhaps a scientist that was among the heroes when they were destroyed (thus accounting for the disintegration). One that has not yet discovered the extent to which he has changed by recreating himself from nothing. But enough of the comments here have convinced me that playing a character in that vein wouldn't be as fun as I originally thought. I kind of thought that having him constantly asking "why should I care?" or having a female "villain" seduce and convince him to act (sort of like Sally Jupiter does to Dr Manhattan on Mars in Watchmen)...


I think an interesting variant of this would be to be a hero who was disintegrated and has come back, but without any memories of his previous life. The villains (or Dr. Destruction) took him in and perhaps the female villain is there as a love interest (a PC is another player is cool with that, or an NPC in another Omega cell).

Where I think it would be fun is over the long term as the memories come back, or perhaps capture and psychic interrogation by the V'sori unlock the lost memories. Then the character has to work out the conflict between his two lives; one where the villains were always the enemies and the other where they are his allies, friends, and possibly love.

It'd be a real kicker if the female villain was his "arch-enemy" before. Did she really care for him or was it just an opportunity to mess with him... or did it start as the latter and then become the former?
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newForumNewName
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clint wrote:
newForumNewName wrote:
I was thinking of a newly minted Dr Manhattan. Perhaps a scientist that was among the heroes when they were destroyed (thus accounting for the disintegration). One that has not yet discovered the extent to which he has changed by recreating himself from nothing. But enough of the comments here have convinced me that playing a character in that vein wouldn't be as fun as I originally thought. I kind of thought that having him constantly asking "why should I care?" or having a female "villain" seduce and convince him to act (sort of like Sally Jupiter does to Dr Manhattan on Mars in Watchmen)...


I think an interesting variant of this would be to be a hero who was disintegrated and has come back, but without any memories of his previous life. The villains (or Dr. Destruction) took him in and perhaps the female villain is there as a love interest (a PC is another player is cool with that, or an NPC in another Omega cell).

Where I think it would be fun is over the long term as the memories come back, or perhaps capture and psychic interrogation by the V'sori unlock the lost memories. Then the character has to work out the conflict between his two lives; one where the villains were always the enemies and the other where they are his allies, friends, and possibly love.

It'd be a real kicker if the female villain was his "arch-enemy" before. Did she really care for him or was it just an opportunity to mess with him... or did it start as the latter and then become the former?

Maybe I'll look into it after all...
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jpk
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honestly, a good character who's lost his power can be a bucketload of fun. We had a space opera game in which I was basically The Emperor who had to use most all his power just to stay alive, so he was effectively reduced to a Novice at the start of the game. Oh, and he was forced to pretend to be one of the good guys, which really bit for him.
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Lord Inar
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, there is one here: http://vulcanstev.wordpress.com/2009/04/21/gaming-in-the-universe-of-the-watchmen-pt2-doctor-manhattan/
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newForumNewName
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Inar wrote:
Well, there is one here: http://vulcanstev.wordpress.com/2009/04/21/gaming-in-the-universe-of-the-watchmen-pt2-doctor-manhattan/

That would take 77 points. Is that even possible at Legendary?
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Sitting Duck
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As long as he remains an NPC. IIRC Dr. Destruction has about 90 points of powers.
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