Username:    Password:      Remember me       
Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group
Discussion Forum for PEG/GWG
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Deviation

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index -> SW General Chat & Game Stories
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
screenmonkey
Veteran


Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 755

PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 8:12 pm    Post subject: Deviation Reply with quote

The rules for area effect deviation (re: "Area Effect Attacks" SWEX65) are too complicated in play for what they accomplish, or maybe it's just me.

Rather than rolling a d6 or a d10 and multiplying by 1, 2 or 3 (but no more than half the distance to the original target), why not just say the missile deviates a random amount ranging from 1" to half the distance to the target?

That way there's no consideration of thrown or fired and which die to use, or whether it was a short, medium or long shot. Just roll a random direction and roll a distance.

Thoughts?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
77IM
Heroic


Joined: 23 Jun 2009
Posts: 1591
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2010 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds fine to me.

Rolling the distance could be weird though. If your target is 14" away, do you roll a d7? Or maybe it deviates 1d50% of the distance, requiring a calculator. Or 1d4/8 of the distance. I think there's probably room for improvement here but am not sure how to phrase it.

-- 77IM
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Clint
Site Admin


Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 17919

PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2010 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

77IM wrote:
Rolling the distance could be weird though. If your target is 14" away, do you roll a d7? Or maybe it deviates 1d50% of the distance, requiring a calculator. Or 1d4/8 of the distance. I think there's probably room for improvement here but am not sure how to phrase it.


That would be my impression as well. It is easier to say it deviates from 1" to half the distance to the target, but then how is that statement actually implemented in the system.

I'd be worried it might be even more complicated in actual play. After all the exact halfway distance has to be determined, where the attack roll just needs to know if the target is within a range increment. In fact, all the stuff for normal deviation is pretty well known if deviation occurs, whether the attack type is thrown or fired and what range increment it is in. The half distance only comes up when the roll is high enough that it might be an issue.

I would suggest that the best way for a simplistic system would not be to remove weapon type and range increments leaving the halfway designation, but to remove weapon types and the half way designation, and just use range increments.

Deviation Distance
Short Range = 1d6"
Medium Range = 2d6"
Long Range = 3d6"

Yeah, it means someone could fumble a grenade and have it drop at their feet or even end up behind them, but what's like without a little excitement Twisted Evil (to avoid that particular excitement, just change the d6's to d4's, so the throw at worst ends up 1" in front of them).
_________________
Clint Black
Savage Worlds Core Rules Brand Manager

www.peginc.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
screenmonkey
Veteran


Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 755

PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2010 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, there's a fair amount of fudging in SW for the sake of simplicity and fun, so if the target is 14" away, then roll a d6. In other words, just add the caveat, "round down" in there somewhere and that would work.

As for eliminating the "half the distance" bit and just going with a flat 1d6, 2d6, 3d6 based on range - well even d4s may give odd results. For example, alchemical thrown goodies have a range of 3/6/12. So you could have a missile deviate farther than you were trying to launch it in the first place - not very heroic.

In any event, it's just a thought. Our session seems to bog whenever an area effect attack deviates, so that's what made me think of trying a simpler method that yielded simlar results.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Sherman
Seasoned


Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 164
Location: Fort Collins CO

PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2010 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deviation is weird and I almost am never happy with how it looks in game. There are so many elements including intervening terrain, elevation differences, type of weapon being used, etc. that will make what "should" happen totally not happen.

Take for example someone trying to shoot a panzerfaust at a tank. If they're shooting down onto a street from the third floor they're not likely to miss by much. However, if they're trying to hit the side from lower or even equal elevation they might "miss" by a hundred yards even if the missile came within inches of the tank.

Also, throwing grenades in hallways is frustrating. They might roll around a bit and arrive in weird places, and I think anyone who's ever played with a ball inside has had it hit a protrusion and come straight back at them, but in general it's hard to miss by too much.

I almost wonder if their is an abstract system that could be created. Miss by 1 such and such happens, miss by 2 this happens, etc. Bigger things happen at bigger numbers which accounts for range and lack of skill... I dunno.
_________________
Gryphon Games & Comics
2020 S College Ave, Suite B
Fort Collins CO 80525
www.gryphongamesandcomics.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
77IM
Heroic


Joined: 23 Jun 2009
Posts: 1591
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about:

You roll the direction die, and the thing deviates 1/4 the distance (round down). Then do it again, deviating from THAT point, by the same distance.

For example, firing at a target 14" away, 1/4 the distance is 3". So you roll the direction die, and it says 4, so go 3" in that direction on the clock facing (to the right and slightly towards the thrower). Then roll again, and it says 8, so from the current position, you go 3" in that direction (left and slightly towards the thrower). In this example the deviation winds up about 1.5" directly towards the thrower.

The most you could deviate is 1/2 the distance (if both directions are the same), and the least is 0" (if the two directions cancel out exactly).

-- 77IM
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group Forum Index -> SW General Chat & Game Stories All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum