Great White Games/Pinnacle Entertainment Group

Evangelos · Seasoned Joined: 20 Jul 2004 Posts: 119

So, a soul tap basically works by siphoning away a portion of the user's life force, and turning it into g-rays that can power junker tech. Would there be any long term effects for this (years of life lost, premature aging, etc), or is the soul tap essentially just using "excess" life force?

This is really more of a setting question than a rules question. Iron Oasis (and presumably Cyborgs) doesn't say anything about any harmful effects, but I was curious as to what other people thought (I'm in the latter camp -- it's using "excess" life energy unless it gets overloaded).

Fuzyfeet · Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2009 6:13 am Post subject:

Interesting question, in the book is says "it can have dangerous consequences for the character" but other than if you used Overload it doesn't really spell give a reason. I wouldn't think it would age someone faster or shortenin' their life span (but what scrapper really makes it to an old wrinkly age anyways right). Ya I figure it only uses what can be siphoned, so it could be considered "excess".
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Snap_Dragon · Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:03 am Post subject:

The overload table can suck your soul out of your body, as can instability rolls I think if the device drains too much power. You can also permanently lower your spirit die type IIRC. To make matters even worse it costs you spirit for a lot of cybernetic bits limiting the use of a soul tap.
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Evangelos · Seasoned Joined: 20 Jul 2004 Posts: 119

Edivdrone · Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 8:14 am Post subject:

IMO, I would say that is a flavor call that the Marshall would have to set up on his own. There is no rules for that sort of thing in the description, and they normally include that sort of thing if it exists. On the other hand, soultaps are pretty new(less than 13 years, probably more like 8 years), so who really knows what the long term affects could be? Another consideration is how long do most people live in the Wasted West, anyway? Violent death is oh so much more common than age related complications these days.
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Lord Skudley · Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 3:10 pm Post subject:

In Shadowrun loss of "Soul" causes "Cyber Madness"... as Edivdron says it's a Marshal Call.

For what it's worth I would permantly reduce the Spirit die type every other time the soull trap is used. The character can, through force of will, increase their Spirit die, but probably not fast enough to make any difference. Once the die gets to d4 they can not raise it and can nolonger use the soul trap...
Alternatly the character can gain the "Elderly" hinderance without the extra 5 skill points...
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Evangelos · Seasoned Joined: 20 Jul 2004 Posts: 119

Lord Skudley · Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 3:39 pm Post subject:

Snap_Dragon · Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 9:02 pm Post subject:

cybernetics in general cause spirit loss, thus you have to walk a fine line between powering and having cybernetics.
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Edivdrone · Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 8:57 am Post subject:

My general opinion on flavor rulings is that you should go with what fits your campaign the best. Since HoE is al about survival, horror, and desperation, anything which enhances that is a plus. On the other hand, it is possible to have that tinged with hope; a world filled with people who steadfastly refuse to cave to the encroaching darkness. A west with a population that is convinced that while things are bad, and likely to get worse before they get better, they will get better, because they determined to make it so.

With respect to this particular question, how does your campaign run? If the creepiness factor is ratcheted up as high as it can go, aging faster or something similar is ideal. This could exhibit itself through wrinkles, liver spots and hair going white at first, working up to the character becoming more frail if around long enough (ARGH!!! MY BRITTLE OLD MAN HIP!!!). If hope is more prominent, perhaps it should be discarded. The Marshal could still decide to keep it if he wants to use it as a goad to push the heros to move faster before time runs out, but it wouldn't fit as well in a campaign where hope is more prominent.
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Lord Lance · Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 2:27 am Post subject:

Sorry for this noob line, but what HoE stays for? Mr. Green

Ray · Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 10:28 am Post subject:

ScooterinAB · Seasoned Joined: 22 Nov 2005 Posts: 480

I would probably just play up the effect via roleplaying. Things like saying that you occassionally wake up a little tired, no matter how much you slept, or feeling not quite all there. Maybe feeling a little detached and apathetic after powering a device. Like a side note every few sessions about how you are losing a part of your own soul to power your bling. Just enough to remind the player exactly what they've done and the long term cost it can have on them, and enough to just keep them down a little. No game effect; purely psychological.

Wendigo1870 · Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:03 pm Post subject: Re: Soul Taps

Fuzyfeet · Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:42 pm Post subject:

I personally think your Harrowed Junker is SOL! He needs to hook up with a good Cyber-doc he trusts and get a Spirit Fetter.
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ScooterinAB · Seasoned Joined: 22 Nov 2005 Posts: 480

My personal take on the matter. If the chap has come back Harrowed, he still has a soul. Thus the Soul Tap should still work. IIRC, the Soul Tap and a Spirit Fetter are essentially the same thing. On a game mechanics level, I would personally rule that they are similar enough to still be usable. To make you go and get a Spirit Fetter to replace an otherwise similar device is kind of moot in my eyes.

That said, the Soul Tap is not fully the same as a Spirit Fetter. The manitou is still free floating (so to speak), and the Tap doesn't give you any kind of Dominion bonus or anything like that. Nor does it impede on Harrowed powers. As a safety though, I'd rule that one could only have a Soul Tap or a Fetter, but not both.

Another thought occurs to me. If the Marshal is a real meanie though, they could rule that the Tap gives a small penalty to Spirit rolls vs the Manitou. The infernal device is eroding your soul after all.
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Fuzyfeet · Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 8:13 pm Post subject:

My problem with the argument that the Soul Tap works in a Harrowed characters is that the first line says it siphons life force. Add to that that it is not an option in cyborgs.
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Ju Ju

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Poor Wandering One · Veteran Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 536

Hmmmm nasty idea.

Say the manitou convinces the poor sucker <cough> junker that the tap still works, that it is actually draining the demon inside. The junker thinks she's found a fountain of free juice but what she is really doing is willingly going to the Manitou for power.

Bye bye dominion.

Unless you clue in before it's too late.

~will

Wendigo1870 · Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 5:00 pm Post subject: