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Tékumel Style Magic For Savage Worlds
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siefertma
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Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 457
Location: Muskego, WI

PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tavis wrote:
.
The folks here are just trying to offer ways that they would/could use the SW magic system as it stands, or with minor trapping tweaks fit what they believe, from your posts, you are after.


As I stated in my previous posts, this is NOT simply a matter of "trapping tweaks." If that were the case, I wouldn't be here. I thought the basic SW spells were too general and did not match the "career progression" (for lack of a better term) for a spellcaster in the setting.

I asked for help molding the SW magic system to match the setting, but all I'm hearing is the mantra "I don't see a difference, so use the stock magic system... I don't see a difference so use the stock magic system..." There IS a difference. There is a MAJOR difference.

Now, I realize that not everyone knows the Tekumel setting. OK, no problem, I'm cool with that. However, despite their ignorance, these same people jump in with suggestions ("Use the stock system.... Use the stock system...") about a setting they admittedly know little, if anything, about. I appreciate the suggestion, but...

In the end all I'm getting is really frustrated to the point where I just want to toss the whole damn project just to make everyone happy. I don't feel that anyone is listening to (or rather, reading) me. If they were, then they'd see my point. I feel like I'm talking (or writing, rather) to a &^%$#@ wall.

Sigh....

I have to go to work. I'm sure I'm going to get lambasted while I'm gone. Fire away.
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siefertma
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Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 457
Location: Muskego, WI

PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, Ok... How about this as a suggestion:

I'll write up the rough draft of my rules and post them here. Then we can go through them and see how well they work. If I can't make them work, I'll go with the stock spells.

Is that acceptable?
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Tavis
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Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 1018
Location: Macclesfield UK

PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's your game - so whatever you ultimately decide to do in that game is 'acceptable' - however, you need to be aware that if you post here asking for opinions, then you'll get them!

If those opinions don't give you the justification, or 'official stamp' or whatever it is that you're looking for, then will you be able to accept that?

If anyone disagreeing with you with regards to your vision of magic in EPT will just cause you personal upset and frustration, then are you able to accept that also?

If you have a personal vision of how the magic should work, and if others don't agree with it you want to stick with your vision anyway - then that's fantastic - your game, your rules - just don't expect others to share an identical vision with you if you ask for their opinions.
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Clint
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Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 18190

PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

siefertma wrote:
Sigh... you know, it's really disheartening to have one of the game designers telling you that your ideas are full of... well.. full of stuff.


I'm sorry if you feel I gave that impression, but it certainly was not the intent, and I'm a bit confused of how it could be taken that way.

There haven't been any real "ideas" of what you are doing posted; only a very brief and generalized overall concept in one short paragraph.

Mostly the comments have been of the nature that SW cannot do X, and my statements have been that SW could indeed do X. If there are other factors involved such as a Y and Z in the setting that SW couldn't do, then I haven't seen it.

Let me try to make my position (and I think that of others) clear...

1. I am not familiar with the setting at all or how magic works in it (I am familiar with the Tri-Stat system, but that is it).
2. So all anyone on this forum in that position has to work with is the information posted in this thread.

If our advice doesn't fit Tekumel/EPT, that's cool, but we can't know why unless we are shown why. Just saying that our advice would "dumb down" the setting doesn't help us understand the differences or give any kind of reason how that would occur.

Now, it may not be possible to explain due to the level of detail involved, but in that case, the best solution is probably to say straight up that it is very detailed and involved and that it will probably require a direct understanding of the setting material to understand fully.

Again, I'm cool with that. There are settings I am unfamiliar with that I am positive have that level of detail, and that was all I was saying above.

It appears from the post I replied to that Tekumel has a level of detail to its magic system that is so important to the setting that to not follow it would "hack off" its fans, but that level of detail hasn't been (and I now don't believe can be) covered in a thread on the forums. So it will take someone with a familiarity with that detail to create a viable conversion.

You (and others) have it, so do it. I don't, so while I wish I could help, I simply can't and honestly feel bad that I have somehow detracted from the goal in any way.

In short, ignore me, and get back to converting the setting you enjoy to a system you enjoy.
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siefertma
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Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 457
Location: Muskego, WI

PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, back from the slave pits. I'm calmer. I'm cooler. I'm more collected than I've been for the last 24 hours. I apologize for being such a jerk, but when I get started on projects like this I tend to get really persnickity and obsessive about details. When I'm in this frame of mind, everything HAS to be perfect and criticism (constructive or not) makes me crazy.

So, In between bouts of being yelled at over the phone by callers, I've given this matter a little more thought. I've decided that there is no reason why I can't give everyone what they want. Therefore, I'm going to come up with TWO magic systems: One that based on the existing SW spells for those who want FFF, and my own which should (hopefully) satisfy EPT die-hards like myself.

GreenTounge's version of Savage Tekumel is the primary inspiration for the FFF version. It will ignore concepts like "Temple Spells" to give it a more "pulpy" feel, but I will have to adjust the ranks according to temple affiliation. For instance: a priest for the Lord Karakan (One of Tekumel's war gods) can learn his temple's version of Bolt as a Novice while the priestess for Lady Avanthe (the Goddess of Fertility) will have to wait until she's Seasoned before she can learn her temple's equivalent of the spell. Some spells, like Zombie, will only be know to a single temple.

After I've posted my ideas here, I'm thinking of taking this discussion off list to a Yahoo group specifically meant for the continued Savaging of Tekumel. Is anyone interested? GreenTounge, Y'all, you're invited.
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Y'all Of Cthulhu
Seasoned


Joined: 14 Sep 2008
Posts: 196
Location: Atlanta, Georgia

PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

siefertma wrote:
After I've posted my ideas here, I'm thinking of taking this discussion off list to a Yahoo group specifically meant for the continued Savaging of Tekumel. Is anyone interested? GreenTounge, Y'all, you're invited.

Absolutely! I need to get my hands on a pdf of the original setting as I haven't seen it in years. I'll more than likely pick that up within the next week (I'm currently studying for the GMAT so all of my spare reading time is being put towards that at the moment; oh, except for that copy of Man of Gold that this thread has inspired me to find on Amazon used, when it gets here. Wink ). If I recall correctly, the original system is a pseudo-OD&D variant; therefore, it might make a quickly-ported-to-Castles-&-Crusades setting as well (just as a note to self, for use until a full Savaged version is done).

Are you considering a conversion of canon-to-date material, or would you be more inclined to start with the original game and then build up from there? Actually, the game could be built much as the setting unfolds for players: a little bit at a time. Mr. Green

This should be a fun project. Cool
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siefertma
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Joined: 16 May 2003
Posts: 457
Location: Muskego, WI

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've already set up the Yahoo groups account:

http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/savage_tekumel/
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GreenTongue
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Joined: 30 Jul 2003
Posts: 1001
Location: Orlando, FL

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At the risk of rubbing you the wrong way, I must admit that I am only truely interested in the Original version.
It doesn't have the social depth of the newer versions but it can scream PULP PLANETARY!! with only a little effort.

As was stated by Richard R.:
Quote:

Jesus...this is so eccentric, personal, trippy, bizarre, jagged, beautiful, crude, and imaginative. It's Edgar Rice Burroughs meets 1960's psychedellic culture meets Imperial China meets the Aztecs in a dark alley behind a brothel in Tangiers, where they bump into a drunken Tolkien and violently sodomize him on a pile of garbage while he begs them not to stop. I can f**king smell the hash smoke coming through the screen of my monitor.

This old version is raw, uncut T'ekumel: You are savage barbarian adventurers living among the dregs of an ancient, racist empire on a world with no white people, no horses, and no stars in the sky.You crawl down into the Underworld with your wicked zig-zag swords and fight acid-trip nightmares for glory, citizenship, and the awesome power of ancient technology. Then you crawl back up to blow all your gold on sex slaves and drugs at the temples of insane gods in teeming, decadent cities. f**k that wannabe Dark Sun... this is the real deal.

===
Found here:
http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?t=425129&page=5

=
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