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Feats of Archery
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drcheckmate
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 8:52 pm    Post subject: Feats of Archery Reply with quote

I know there is a Robin Hood pdf available, but I lack the funds at the moment.

I'm wondering, if you were running a game using characters like Robin Hood, Green Arrow, Hawkeye, and the like... Would you want to represent their prowess with Edges or a list of genre/campaign specific Tricks?

I just don't think a whole lot of edges for things like disarming, cutting nooses, catching arrows, splitting arrows... I don't think such a list is in the spirit of FFF or the genre.

BUT! Here is my quandary, what to include on such a list of tricks and what not to. Depending on your level of tolerance for trick arrows and arrow tricks you might very well want to make some of the tricks edges.

This is more a game design theory and philosophy question than fishing for mechanics, but I am not going to raise a fuss if some one wants to include their house rules.

If it helps the setting is post-apocalyptic and dystopic. I see the players as a Robin and his Merry Men like band who not only do the wealth re-distribution thing, but also a Green Beret style teach the natives how to defend themselves from marauders. I dig anachronism. One of my guidelines is, "guns are for scoundrels, anti-heroes, and villains."
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zeth
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well some basic tricks would be the 'Arched Shot' unlike guns arrows don't need to follow a straight line and you can shoot in an arc attacking a target from above. This would ignore the prone target penalty or ignore/reduce the penalty some types of cover provide like if some one is ducking behind some crates but has nothing above them.
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drcheckmate
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, zeth! I hadn't thought of that!
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Tuesday
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A lot of Robin's tricks can be expressed by Improved Trademark Weapon, Marksman, and the like.

It's easy enough to add an Edge for "-1 to range penalties" or "add another range increment at -6, called Extreme, twice as far as Long" or "-1 to called shot penalties" or "-1 to Cover penalties"

Or all of the above, really. You don't need an Edge to cut a noose or split an Arrow - that's a shot at -6 for a tiny target, probably at -4 for range, so you need Improved Trademark, Marksman, Improved Lack Of Range Penalties (-1 at med, -2 at Long, -4 at Extreme), Improved Good At Called Shots - and suddenly your incredible, impossible -10 shot is now -2, which is a heck of a lot easier.

Just make all of those "tricks" different shooting rolls, and let your Edges make some shooting rolls easier.
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Vulcan Stev
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess I'd come up with an edge similar to the MacGyver Edge. Link it to agility and strength. Allow this person to preform more uncanny feats with a bow and arrow and the shooting skill.

Let your players who have the edge think of their own trick shots. Gimmick Arrows limited to pre-generated list for each session (ie: no "I pull my Shark-Repellant-Arrow out of my quiver")
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drcheckmate
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

*waves at Stev!*

I might do some MythBusters-style research, determine what the most outright improbapossible shots would be and make those edges, then handle the rest more or less as Tuesday outlines (Thanks, Tuesday!)

As to gimmick arrows. I think I want the technology to be fairly realistic, so no boxing gloves and no shark repellent. Other than wikipedia, does anyone know a good place on line for this sort of research?

Sudden image of Hog Archers. Mounted archers on harleys instead of horses... Sorry. That was random.
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Tavis
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shaintar has a couple of good Archer edges - both of which I believe are shown in the Edges Compendium thread on these very boards and over at Savagepedia - though I'm sure Sean would appreciate you buying his lovely, lovely book too.
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Karnaze
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If these trick shots have no combat value, ie are mainly just for show, like splitting an arrow then you could cover it with other rules. Splitting an arrow to impress might be an intimidate roll or an agility trick to set up an opponent for something else the next round. In fact most of them could likely be covered as agility tricks. Maybe create an edge similar to acrobat...

Trick Shot - The character gets a +2 to agility tricks, shots made against inanimate targets, and intimidate rolls involving the use of a bow. If the character takes a round to aim the bonus increases to +4.

This could cover everything from disarming an opponent to splitting arrows to tripping someone with the bow to cutting ropes.
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zeth
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guns have armor piercing, might ant to let players buy modern day 'man killer' arrows to even the field.
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Lord Lance
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

x Zeth: Many modern armors (in the game) have a Anti Armor Piercing value of 4, so the AP of the guns is quite useless on equal field (i.e. modern guns vs modern armors).
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Ian
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Medieval longbowmen had bodkin arrows for war (armour piercing) and broadhead arrows for hunting (more damage against an unarmoured target), Ian
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Clint
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Lance wrote:
x Zeth: Many modern armors (in the game) have a Anti Armor Piercing value of 4, so the AP of the guns is quite useless on equal field (i.e. modern guns vs modern armors).


Why not just remove the AP of modern guns and give AP to arrows. It sounds like a simple setting rule...

Threaded Construction: Modern materials were all made in a ballistic resistant process, so firearms lose any AP rating in the setting. The same process makes the material more vulnerable to cutting and piercing attacks, so all blades and arrows gain AP2 (or AP4 or whatever depending on the setting's armor values).
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drcheckmate
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't see body armor of any kind being a big part of the setting, so for the most part, I see the archers and gunners on fairly equal terms. If I was using armored opponents it would be to give targets to those archers with d10s and 12s and bonus edges some nice squishy targets for called shots.
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Bewildered Badger
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

drcheckmate wrote:

As to gimmick arrows. I think I want the technology to be fairly realistic, so no boxing gloves and no shark repellent. Other than wikipedia, does anyone know a good place on line for this sort of research?



Necessary Evil has 'trick projectiles' that might be appropriate.
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Lord Lance
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clint wrote:

Why not just remove the AP of modern guns and give AP to arrows. It sounds like a simple setting rule...

x drcheckmate: this could be a fast way to "fix" the bows in your game.

However, in a survival post war game, a bow is quite useful, 'cause:
- does not produce noise, noise is bad! Wink
- you can easily create arrows by yourself, with a nice Repair roll and some spare time; then, infinite ammo! Wink
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Takeda
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A sharp blade-headed arrow will go right through a kevlar vest unless it has resin plates to back it up ... I agree with Clint.

Another way to look at it, armour in the modern sense should/has bonus toughness that is limited to ballistic weapons ... they suck against shrapnel, piercing and to a limited degree bladed weapons, very sharp anything, suck against concussive force too ... so the shock-wave from an explosion goes right through it. Example: kevlar can be penetrated with a 5.62 mm jacketed round ... same with a .22L if it is higher velocity such as from a rifle or at very close range if a pistol.

If you watched Future Weapons they had Dragon Skin Armour with was effectively kevlar with ceramic inserts in a scalemail configuration ... worked very well and would against piercing, ballistic, cutting, even stopped high-velocity rounds that went through 1/4" steel plate. The shockwave from an explosion would still be a problem but the design would have even reduced the affect of a shockwave with all the different components sucking up the forces.
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Lord Inar
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I'd of course love for you to get the Sherwood PDF, but if you can't at the moment, it's understood!

Another tack (different from Sherwood), especially for the Green Arrow/Hawkeye-type is to do AB (Superpowers or Weird Science) with Shooting as the skill and arrows as the trapping.

Smoke Arrow- Obscure
Multiple Arrows - Blast
Titanium Arrows - Smite
Conscussion Grenade Arrows - Stun
etc.

Just a thought.

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Lord Inar
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Feats of Archery Reply with quote

drcheckmate wrote:
One of my guidelines is, "guns are for scoundrels, anti-heroes, and villains."


A way to enforce such an ideal is to say that you can't bennie gun shooting rolls, as that is the way of cowards and cowards are not rewarded!
That way you are not removing it as a possibility, but you are actively discouraging it.
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Takeda
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taking an Edge like:

Trick Shot
Requirements: Agility d8, Shooting d10, Marksman.
Benefits: Reduces penalties for targeting a specific body part or small target by -2.
Limitations: Must not move in the round that it is used.

Improved Trick Shot
Requirements: Trick Shot, Agility d8, Shooting d12, Marksman.
Benefits: Further reduces penalties for targeting a specific body part or small target by -2.
Limitations: Must not move in the round that it is used.
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Lord Lance
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Inar wrote:
Another tack (different from Sherwood), especially for the Green Arrow/Hawkeye-type is to do AB (Superpowers or Weird Science) with Shooting as the skill and arrows as the trapping.

Smoke Arrow- Obscure
Multiple Arrows - Blast
Titanium Arrows - Smite
Conscussion Grenade Arrows - Stun
etc.

Sometime, the simplest solutions are the better... FFF baby!

x Takeda: those are NOT trick shots... Those are simply a "Make the archer a broken super effective rulebreaker character". Neutral Neutral
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